INTERVIEW: Cardinal Husar speaks on UGCC's new projects

LVIV - Though it was the close of a hectic week marked by celebrations of the inauguration of the new Ukrainian Catholic University (UCU), and with the opening of the Ukrainian Greek-Catholic Sobor (a gathering of the Church's laity and clergy) only hours away, Cardinal Lubomyr Husar, archbishop major of the UGCC, nonetheless found time to meet with The Ukrainian Weekly's Kyiv editor, Roman Woronowycz. The two discussed the myriad projects that the reinvigorated Church is undertaking and how it plans to see them to fruition. Following is an edited transcript of the interview, which was held in the Patriarchal Palace of St. George Cathedral in Lviv on June 30.

Q: What does the new Ukrainian Catholic University (UCU) in Lviv mean for the Ukrainian Greek-Catholic Church (UGCC) and for Ukraine overall? What has changed with the opening of this newest institution of higher learning in Ukraine?

A: As was said yesterday, there are 106 universities functioning in Ukraine, this is the 107th. This is the only one that is Christian at its base. My intention is not to insult people of other universities, to say they are godless and atheistic, because this is far from true. In the eastern provinces of Ukraine there are good and God-believing people at the universities, rectors, professors and students who attend them.

But what type of university is this? What is the difference between a Catholic university and a secular university? All universities have the same goal: to serve truth, to search for the truth, to teach the truth, to develop the intellect maximally and to prepare people for life.

Catholic universities throughout the world, - I believe there are 900 of them in all - are universities just like all others, with the exception that they address matters from a Christian point of view. They take under consideration religious truths as well. There are those who suggest that this lowers the value of the university, that this type of university cannot serve the truth because it must serve religious goals.

We respond to this by saying that there are no differences between religion and intellect. These are simply two different ways of looking at the truth. You can say that this is a fundamental basis for the existence of Catholic universities: that between faith and knowledge there are no differences.

Q: And this means what in terms of the UCU being the first Christian university in Ukraine?

A: The Kyiv-Mohyla Academy during its earlier existence was not called a university, but it had all the attributes of a university. It was an institution of higher learning with a theology faculty. The various fields were titled differently, but it was truly a great institution, not some sort of seminary. People from the various Slavic nations traveled there to study. It was the only institution of higher learning during those times in the Slavic Orthodox world.

Today it is private, but still partly government-controlled. Yesterday, as I sat next to the president of [the National University of] Kyiv-Mohyla Academy (Dr. Viacheslav Briukhovetsky), I told him that perhaps he should consider making his school a center of Orthodox study, a center of theology. He told me that he is very interested in doing so, but it is a matter of money.

The [Orthodox] need their own school, just as our Protestants need a good theology school - not just a seminary to train the purveyors of the faith, but a real university. It is needed for Ukraine in general. We need to speak with them about doing so.

If the Catholics, Orthodox and Protestants had higher educational schools, I believe there would be more desire for peaceful co-existence and cooperation, for a search for God's common roads. Some declare that if there is a Catholic university, an Orthodox university and a Protestant university, hatred will rise to new heights.

However, real, sincere education leads to the opposite. It leads to calm, erudite conclusions that do not inflame, but calm passions.

Q: When can we expect that the various branches, buildings, faculties, territories, etc. of the new UCU will be completed and functioning?

A: We must understand that we cannot do everything at once. We must proceed in stages, and for a very straightforward reason. We receive a lot of support from our [diaspora communities], especially from North America. But we cannot bury North America with 10 projects at once and expect to gather the needed funds. People simply cannot afford it; they do not have that much money.

We hope shortly to develop an overall plan by which we will ask for funds in stages. We will finish one [project] before going on to the next one, and then the third one, and so on. We are not that well off, either here in Ukraine or beyond it.

Q: And that plan is in the works?

A: Well, it is being considered, but is neither completed nor approved.

Q: This is an exciting time for the UGCC, both in its spiritual and physical development. A symbol of this is the planned move of the patriarchal, or archiepiscopal, center from Lviv to Kyiv. When will it happen, how will the move look and first of all, when will the cathedral be completed?

A: We have chosen a construction firm and in the last days have been working on a contract. The sooner we begin the better.

Q: Are we talking days, weeks, months?

A: If the contract were to be signed today, construction could begin tomorrow, you see. We have all the documentation. It's been a matter of bureaucracy. Just as we thought we finally had everything, a new law appeared forcing us to redo some matters. Now, however, we have everything: all the signatures, all the necessary stamps.

We have accepted a tender. There was a competitive bid during which various firms presented their projects. Of the seven that took part, we considered four workable. We picked one from those four. All four were Kyiv companies. Now we are moving to complete a contract.

A requirement of the tender was that the project be completed within two years, and all the firms said they could comply. If money flows steadily, there is no doubt that it can be completed within two years.

Q: Therefore, in two years you will slowly begin the move to Kyiv?

A: The situation is like this: within two years we expect a completed church ready for use. It will not be decorated, simply ready for use. At the same time, we will be constructing another building, which will take slightly longer because the concentration will be on the sobor [cathedral], but no more than three years all together.

Our move to Kyiv is not really tied to this. When some money appears, I will be looking for a place in Kyiv where I will be able to work and host people. It will be a residency, but a limited one, yet still the beginning of a center.

The move will be gradual. It will not be a situation where one day we bring in the trucks, load them up and tomorrow we are in Kyiv. That will not happen, more so, because Lviv has its needs as well. We do not have the right to leave Lviv without securing its future. This process is happening slowly, but it is happening. There are problems that still need to be ironed out. Lviv is an archiepiscopy, and it must have an appropriate person responsible. It is not such a simple matter.

It is difficult to say [how long the move will take]. We do not have concrete plans as to what comes after what. We are in a difficult phase, what with our new university, the sobor, etc. At some point we need to sit down and carefully calculate who should move when and when I should move. I don't have all that much to move myself, but we have our archives and we have the offices.

Q: Have the Orthodox expressed negative attitudes to the announced move?

A: There are various attitudes. There are those who are terribly against it. They say it is aggression - not simply by us, but by the Vatican - and an invasion of Orthodox canonical territory, that we are pushing into areas not ours.

On the other hand, there are many Orthodox, who, unofficially, tell us they cannot wait for us to move. They say that the center is supposed to be in Kyiv.

The reaction of the Orthodox has varied. For instance the Moscow Patriarchate desperately does not want us there for various reasons - I would guess maybe they are scared of us - I don't know, for many reasons.

However, the Orthodox intelligentsia is amenable. Many people of various walks of life - whether from politics, the sciences, the arts or social sciences - are the ones asking: "when are you moving? The sooner the better."

Q: What about the Ukrainian Orthodox Church - Kyiv Patriarchate? What's its stance?

A: They are not negatively disposed, as far as I know. I have not heard any declarations that they are against it.

Q: How is the process of fund-raising moving along?

A: We made an initial decision that we would be very careful with fund-raising until we were sure that we were going to be able to do this and had found a place. We needed to make sure our plans were certain because this is the third time we are attempting this in Kyiv. At one point we had even blessed the land. We are being very wary this time.

Nonetheless, for about a half-year now we have been fund-raising. I wrote an address to notify people and suggested that those who have a desire to donate should do so through their local bishops. On the other hand, we also urged the bishops to organize something. Unfortunately, the response from North America, in particular, has been very poor. Nothing was organized. Bishop Vasyl and I get telephone calls here and in Kyiv telling us that people want to contribute but do not know where to do so. The bishops did a bad job organizing a fund-raising drive.

Every project has its individual characteristics. For example, the seminary and the theology academy to a large extent, while not exclusively, are an all-Ukrainian project, although I am excited that we will be sufficiently strong that our bishops [from the diaspora communities] may be sending their students to us, for higher studies at least.

However, the construction of the sobor in Kyiv has a very different nature. I believe this project is not limited to the territory of Ukraine. This will be the seat of the head of the Church. The whole Church should support this.

It doesn't matter if individuals give a thousand dollars, or a single dollar or a hryvnia or a single coin. What matters is that everyone contributes something, within his means, to this. It is important that this is a Church-wide effort.

The sobor in Kyiv is supposed to be a symbol. It is the patriarchal cathedral. It is in the capital city. It has a very special character.

Q: I would like to move to another topic. On July 1 the Patriarchal Sobor of the UGCC's laity and clergy began. What would you like to see this gathering resolve, propose or approve?

A: I want to bring attention to the social aspects of Christianity. This means that people must realize their social responsibilities. We, as Christians, must live within society and care for the common good. We must keep our social environment sacred and keep it worthy of humans. This is what the social teachings of the Church are for. They touch on all aspects of human life in society. We want to bring attention to some of the problems in our social life and to propose to people a concrete and simple program for realization.

What type of citizen should a Christian be? Should he maintain that his house is on the perimeter, that only heaven concerns him? Should he maintain that what happens on Earth does not interest him, and so he feels no responsibility to help his fellow man? Can he expect to fold his arms and wait for something to occur, or must he actively work to help better life within society.

We hope to make progress in this part of our life. This is very important? Life is based on daily mundane details. The Church should not leave this alone. It must take these issues up. The Church should be where people work and where they relax. The Church must be with its people everywhere and always.

Q: Is this directed at life in Ukraine or in the entire Church?

A: Everywhere. This was merely one example. Another example is the problem of the family. There are Ukrainians in America, Argentina, Brazil, Australia and Ukraine, and they all have family problems. How should a Ukrainian family look? What values should it uphold?

Or, what type of priests do we want? In Ukraine, America, Canada, Australia. There is a certain accent, undoubtedly.

Shouldn't our Ukrainians in America be more active in societal matters? Not just as Ukrainians, but as Christians, to take part in the social environment in which they live and to be active within the social services of their communities, and not simply to live within their ghettos. Here I mean both priests and laypeople. It is expected that people be creative, industrious and helpful within the societies in which they live.

Q: Turning to the sensitive matter of pedophilia and sex abuse, which has become the source of anxiety and pain within the larger Catholic Church and particularly in the United States, has their been a review to determine whether there are sex abuse and pedophilia problems within the UGCC?

A: Absolutely. We as bishops have become a lot more cautious - I would say sensitive - because without a doubt this plague, as I will call it, is everywhere in the world. Just because a person is married, whether clergy or a layperson, does not mean they are not subject to such difficulties. They can still become the initiators or the victims of such crimes. We have become more sensitive, and we understand the difficulty of the matter.

In America the matter has been greatly overblown. If there are 90,000 instances [of child abuse] in America annually, there are only 400 priests allegedly involved. There is a directed concerted propaganda effort going on against the Church - this is quite obvious. Why and how is another matter.

However, the fact remains that the problem did not begin with propaganda, negative or positive, it has its roots elsewhere. It has been overblown without a doubt; nonetheless the positive element is that the problem has been identified, and we are now more sensitive to it.

The situation is very, very delicate. It is not easy to work in this situation.

Q: While I believe you answered this already in passing, please elaborate on whether the fact that the UGCC has a married priesthood lessens the problem for it.

A: It is very difficult to say. I do not think this is necessarily connected to marriage, or non-marriage or that this is necessarily an integral part of the problem of homosexuality. It has its history, its causes in sick people, who perform terrible acts of abuse.

Q: Is the problem a reflection of modern society, in your opinion?

A: To a degree, yes. We have a society today, let's say in Europe, for which human life has come to have no meaning. You can kill an unborn child. You can kill yourself. You can help another person die or ask him to help you die, in other words, euthanasia.

When homosexuality is generally recognized as something almost good and when on an official level same-sex marriages are allowed, and it is accepted that these couples can not only live together but can legally adopt children, in this type of society - where pornography is extensive as well - we cannot be surprised that very serious temptations arise. Any type of person can succumb to them. This is a time that requires extreme sensitivity by a person over himself, first of all, and then a great sensitivity to those with supervisory responsibility over their subordinates.

Copyright © The Ukrainian Weekly, July 7, 2002, No. 27, Vol. LXX

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